Comments on: The Democratic “race” is over for Clinton..even her campaign admits it. http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/ My personal opinions on social and political issues from a progressive standpoint. Fri, 21 Nov 2008 23:08:46 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Sammy http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14881 Sammy Tue, 06 May 2008 20:56:06 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14881 To long have we waited for a woman president in American, and you bet for sure we would rather rip the dems apart then let Obama win. its are right to see Clinton as pres, no matter the cost!<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14881','Sammy'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14881','Sammy','To long have we waited for a woman president in American, and you bet for sure we would rather rip the dems apart then let Obama win. its are right to see Clinton as pres, no matter the cost!'); return false;">Quote</a></div> To long have we waited for a woman president in American, and you bet for sure we would rather rip the dems apart then let Obama win. its are right to see Clinton as pres, no matter the cost!
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]]> By: thebraintrust http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14115 thebraintrust Tue, 25 Mar 2008 04:58:01 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14115 Hillary would really have to run up big scores to get anywhere close to a win in the popular vote. She has been 56% or higher 4 times (Arkansas, Mass, NY, and RI). Even if you throw Ohio in there, since she got close, that is nowhere near the 8 times she will have to do it from here on out. I would be shocked if she got that high in more than 3 states (Penn, West Virginia and Kentucky). I bet Obama reaches that level in North Carolina and Oregon and probably South Dakota, so it would be pretty much a wash. Hillary cannot catch him in delegates, and will not catch him in popular vote. It is not that Obama supporters are scared of Hillary, I think most privately laugh at how her campaign has never taken off. Probably reminds most Libs of the Ignatieff campaign, lots of generals and very few foot soldiers. What people are disappointed in is the fact that Clinton supporters appear to be hell-bent on destroying the party rather than working together. They would rather support McCain, a man who has dubious relations with female lobbyists to say the least, a man who is all for going to war with Iran, a man who wants to stay in Iraq for a hundred years, a man who was at the center of the Lincoln Savings and Loan scandal (a scandal eerily reminiscent of Bear Stearns), a man who was against the Bush tax cuts before he was for them, the fact he was against the Bush/Cheney torture legislation before he was for it, the fact he was against agents of intollerance before he stood shoulder to shoulder with them. That is what is disappointing. Anyone who can say they would rather support McCain than Obama are probably the same people waiting for the Ignatieff silver bullet to save the Liberal party. Basically a bunch of know-it-alls that talk alot but rarely, if ever, do anything on the ground. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14115','thebraintrust'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14115','thebraintrust','Hillary would really have to run up big scores to get anywhere close to a win in the popular vote. She has been 56% or higher 4 times (Arkansas, Mass, NY, and RI). Even if you throw Ohio in there, since she got close, that is nowhere near the 8 times she will have to do it from here on out. I would be shocked if she got that high in more than 3 states (Penn, West Virginia and Kentucky). I bet Obama reaches that level in North Carolina and Oregon and probably South Dakota, so it would be pretty much a wash. \r\n\r\nHillary cannot catch him in delegates, and will not catch him in popular vote. It is not that Obama supporters are scared of Hillary, I think most privately laugh at how her campaign has never taken off. Probably reminds most Libs of the Ignatieff campaign, lots of generals and very few foot soldiers. \r\n\r\nWhat people are disappointed in is the fact that Clinton supporters appear to be hell-bent on destroying the party rather than working together. They would rather support McCain, a man who has dubious relations with female lobbyists to say the least, a man who is all for going to war with Iran, a man who wants to stay in Iraq for a hundred years, a man who was at the center of the Lincoln Savings and Loan scandal (a scandal eerily reminiscent of Bear Stearns), a man who was against the Bush tax cuts before he was for them, the fact he was against the Bush\/Cheney torture legislation before he was for it, the fact he was against agents of intollerance before he stood shoulder to shoulder with them. That is what is disappointing. Anyone who can say they would rather support McCain than Obama are probably the same people waiting for the Ignatieff silver bullet to save the Liberal party. Basically a bunch of know-it-alls that talk alot but rarely, if ever, do anything on the ground. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Hillary would really have to run up big scores to get anywhere close to a win in the popular vote. She has been 56% or higher 4 times (Arkansas, Mass, NY, and RI). Even if you throw Ohio in there, since she got close, that is nowhere near the 8 times she will have to do it from here on out. I would be shocked if she got that high in more than 3 states (Penn, West Virginia and Kentucky). I bet Obama reaches that level in North Carolina and Oregon and probably South Dakota, so it would be pretty much a wash.

Hillary cannot catch him in delegates, and will not catch him in popular vote. It is not that Obama supporters are scared of Hillary, I think most privately laugh at how her campaign has never taken off. Probably reminds most Libs of the Ignatieff campaign, lots of generals and very few foot soldiers.

What people are disappointed in is the fact that Clinton supporters appear to be hell-bent on destroying the party rather than working together. They would rather support McCain, a man who has dubious relations with female lobbyists to say the least, a man who is all for going to war with Iran, a man who wants to stay in Iraq for a hundred years, a man who was at the center of the Lincoln Savings and Loan scandal (a scandal eerily reminiscent of Bear Stearns), a man who was against the Bush tax cuts before he was for them, the fact he was against the Bush/Cheney torture legislation before he was for it, the fact he was against agents of intollerance before he stood shoulder to shoulder with them. That is what is disappointing. Anyone who can say they would rather support McCain than Obama are probably the same people waiting for the Ignatieff silver bullet to save the Liberal party. Basically a bunch of know-it-alls that talk alot but rarely, if ever, do anything on the ground.

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]]> By: Ted http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14114 Ted Tue, 25 Mar 2008 01:32:54 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14114 Wow...Just saw Carville on the Wolf Blitzer show, he is not backing off . He stand by every comment regarding Richardson.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14114','Ted'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14114','Ted','Wow...Just saw Carville on the Wolf Blitzer show, he is not backing off . He stand by every comment regarding Richardson.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Wow…Just saw Carville on the Wolf Blitzer show, he is not backing off . He stand by every comment regarding Richardson.
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]]> By: Demosthenes http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14100 Demosthenes Mon, 24 Mar 2008 05:54:14 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14100 KC: well put. In order for Clinton to win, she'd need to set the superdelegates against the grassroots' delegates.  And, barring a Really Good Reason for doing so (Wright ain't that reason), the superdelegates won't want that kind of spectacle.  They'd face a revolt from Black America, and for good reason. And I somehow doubt Clinton will maintain a 55% lead in the popular vote from here on out. Especially when she's got her husband calling Obama unpatriotic. (Which is what that "McCarthy" thing was about. Funny how Antonio so carefully danced around <em>Clinton's</em> comments, huh?)<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14100','Demosthenes'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14100','Demosthenes','KC: well put. In order for Clinton to win, she\'d need to set the superdelegates against the grassroots\' delegates.  And, barring a Really Good Reason for doing so (Wright ain\'t that reason), the superdelegates won\'t want that kind of spectacle.  They\'d face a revolt from Black America, and for good reason.\r\n\r\nAnd I somehow doubt Clinton will maintain a 55% lead in the popular vote from here on out. Especially when she\'s got her husband calling Obama unpatriotic. \r\n\r\n(Which is what that &quot;McCarthy&quot; thing was about. Funny how Antonio so carefully danced around <em>Clinton\'s<\/em> comments, huh?)'); return false;">Quote</a></div> KC: well put. In order for Clinton to win, she’d need to set the superdelegates against the grassroots’ delegates.  And, barring a Really Good Reason for doing so (Wright ain’t that reason), the superdelegates won’t want that kind of spectacle.  They’d face a revolt from Black America, and for good reason.

And I somehow doubt Clinton will maintain a 55% lead in the popular vote from here on out. Especially when she’s got her husband calling Obama unpatriotic.

(Which is what that "McCarthy" thing was about. Funny how Antonio so carefully danced around Clinton’s comments, huh?)

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]]> By: Antonio Di Domizio http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14089 Antonio Di Domizio Sun, 23 Mar 2008 23:21:54 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14089 sorry I just got home from easter dinner, I had no intention to mislead, I did mean popular vote. As for you Scott, Michael Ignatieff, Bob Rae, Gerard Kennedy, Stephane Dion. The "old guard is bad" argument is a little rich coming from you...<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14089','Antonio Di Domizio'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14089','Antonio Di Domizio','sorry I just got home from easter dinner, I had no intention to mislead, I did mean popular vote.\r\n\r\nAs for you Scott, Michael Ignatieff, Bob Rae, Gerard Kennedy, Stephane Dion.\r\n\r\nThe &quot;old guard is bad&quot; argument is a little rich coming from you...'); return false;">Quote</a></div> sorry I just got home from easter dinner, I had no intention to mislead, I did mean popular vote.

As for you Scott, Michael Ignatieff, Bob Rae, Gerard Kennedy, Stephane Dion.

The "old guard is bad" argument is a little rich coming from you…

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]]> By: KC http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14084 KC Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:38:59 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14084 Steve - This is a silly argument I've heard from Clinton supporters before.   The reality is that superdelegates can vote so the "threshold" of elected delegates a candidate has to surpass to win before convention has always taken that into account.   If the superdelegates respect the will of the voters--and dont overturn their votes--the threshold for winning is actually 50%+1 of the elected delegates which even you concede Obama will likely obtain.   In other words Obama only needs superdelegates to win because superdelegates exist.  If they didnt he would be the presumptive nominee.  There is a big difference between saying Clinton needs the superdelegates to win and saying Obama needs the superdelegates to win.  Clinton needs them to win period.  Obama only needs them to avoid having the elected delegates overriden. You may have been suggesting that Clinton can win the popular vote with 55-45 but Antonio quite clearly meant that she can surpass him in delegates with those numbers which is a crock. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14084','KC'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14084','KC','Steve - This is a silly argument I\'ve heard from Clinton supporters before.   The reality is that superdelegates can vote so the &quot;threshold&quot; of elected delegates a candidate has to surpass to win before convention has always taken that into account.   If the superdelegates respect the will of the voters--and dont overturn their votes--the threshold for winning is actually 50%+1 of the elected delegates which even you concede Obama will likely obtain.   In other words Obama only needs superdelegates to win because superdelegates exist.  If they didnt he would be the presumptive nominee.  There is a big difference between saying Clinton needs the superdelegates to win and saying Obama needs the superdelegates to win.  Clinton needs them to win period.  Obama only needs them to avoid having the elected delegates overriden.\r\n\r\nYou may have been suggesting that Clinton can win the popular vote with 55-45 but Antonio quite clearly meant that she can surpass him in delegates with those numbers which is a crock. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Steve - This is a silly argument I’ve heard from Clinton supporters before.   The reality is that superdelegates can vote so the "threshold" of elected delegates a candidate has to surpass to win before convention has always taken that into account.   If the superdelegates respect the will of the voters–and dont overturn their votes–the threshold for winning is actually 50%+1 of the elected delegates which even you concede Obama will likely obtain.   In other words Obama only needs superdelegates to win because superdelegates exist.  If they didnt he would be the presumptive nominee.  There is a big difference between saying Clinton needs the superdelegates to win and saying Obama needs the superdelegates to win.  Clinton needs them to win period.  Obama only needs them to avoid having the elected delegates overriden.

You may have been suggesting that Clinton can win the popular vote with 55-45 but Antonio quite clearly meant that she can surpass him in delegates with those numbers which is a crock. 

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]]> By: Steve v http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14083 Steve v Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:24:31 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14083 I was talking about popular vote, which is a 55-45 proposition, without Flo and Mich.  There is no way she can catch Obama in delegates, especially without those two states. I would add though, the super-delegate argument is funny, considering Obama will need them too.  Both candidates need the super-delegates to put them over the top, which speaks to just how close things really are.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14083','Steve v'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14083','Steve v','I was talking about popular vote, which is a 55-45 proposition, without Flo and Mich.  There is no way she can catch Obama in delegates, especially without those two states.\r\n\r\nI would add though, the super-delegate argument is funny, considering Obama will need them too.  Both candidates need the super-delegates to put them over the top, which speaks to just how close things really are.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> I was talking about popular vote, which is a 55-45 proposition, without Flo and Mich.  There is no way she can catch Obama in delegates, especially without those two states.

I would add though, the super-delegate argument is funny, considering Obama will need them too.  Both candidates need the super-delegates to put them over the top, which speaks to just how close things really are.

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]]> By: Scott Tribe http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14082 Scott Tribe Sun, 23 Mar 2008 19:03:22 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14082 Ted: Carville's a real piece of work isn't he? By using that comparison, I guess that means if we use Bill Richardson as the metaphor for Judas Iscariot, Hillary is supposed to be Jesus? As said <a href="http://firedoglake.com/2008/03/23/somebody-needs-an-anger-management-class/" rel="nofollow">elsewhere</a>, Carville is one to be talking about betrayal, when he was the one trying to do an open coup against Howard Dean and trying to get him removed as DNC chairperson (which utterly failed). Carville represents the "old guard" (maybe just plain old) of the Democratic Party, and the Clintons are in that group. Time for fresh blood and fresh ideas.. and fresh hope.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14082','Scott Tribe'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14082','Scott Tribe','Ted:\r\n\r\nCarville\'s a real piece of work isn\'t he? By using that comparison, I guess that means if we use Bill Richardson as the metaphor for Judas Iscariot, Hillary is supposed to be Jesus? \r\n\r\nAs said <a href=\"http:\/\/firedoglake.com\/2008\/03\/23\/somebody-needs-an-anger-management-class\/\" rel=\"nofollow\">elsewhere<\/a>, Carville is one to be talking about betrayal, when he was the one trying to do an open coup against Howard Dean and trying to get him removed as DNC chairperson (which utterly failed). Carville represents the &quot;old guard&quot; (maybe just plain old) of the Democratic Party, and the Clintons are in that group.\r\n\r\nTime for fresh blood and fresh ideas.. and fresh hope.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Ted:

Carville’s a real piece of work isn’t he? By using that comparison, I guess that means if we use Bill Richardson as the metaphor for Judas Iscariot, Hillary is supposed to be Jesus?

As said elsewhere, Carville is one to be talking about betrayal, when he was the one trying to do an open coup against Howard Dean and trying to get him removed as DNC chairperson (which utterly failed). Carville represents the "old guard" (maybe just plain old) of the Democratic Party, and the Clintons are in that group.

Time for fresh blood and fresh ideas.. and fresh hope.

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]]> By: Scott Tribe http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14081 Scott Tribe Sun, 23 Mar 2008 18:59:51 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14081 Thanks for those numbers on delegates, KC. It's obvious a few Clinton supporters on here are engaging in fantasy math.<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14081','Scott Tribe'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14081','Scott Tribe','Thanks for those numbers on delegates, KC. It\'s obvious a few Clinton supporters on here are engaging in fantasy math.'); return false;">Quote</a></div> Thanks for those numbers on delegates, KC. It’s obvious a few Clinton supporters on here are engaging in fantasy math.
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]]> By: Ted http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14064 Ted Sun, 23 Mar 2008 18:56:01 +0000 http://scottdiatribe.gluemeat.com/2008/03/22/the-democratic-race-is-over-for-clintoneven-her-campaign-admits-it/#comment-14064 Bill Richardson endorsment of Obama: NYT Today“An act of betrayal,” said James Carville an adviser to Mrs. Clinton and a friend of Mr. Clinton. “Mr. Richardson’s endorsement came right around the anniversary of the day when Judas sold out for 30 pieces of silver, so I think the timing is appropriate, if ironic,” Mr. Carville said, referring to Holy Week. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('14064','Ted'); return false;">Reply</a> - <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('14064','Ted','Bill Richardson endorsment of Obama: NYT TodayâAn act of betrayal,â said James Carville an adviser to Mrs. Clinton and a friend of Mr. Clinton. âMr. Richardsonâs endorsement came right around the anniversary of the day when Judas sold out for 30 pieces of silver, so I think the timing is appropriate, if ironic,â Mr. Carville said, referring to Holy Week. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Bill Richardson endorsment of Obama: NYT Today“An act of betrayal,” said James Carville an adviser to Mrs. Clinton and a friend of Mr. Clinton. “Mr. Richardson’s endorsement came right around the anniversary of the day when Judas sold out for 30 pieces of silver, so I think the timing is appropriate, if ironic,” Mr. Carville said, referring to Holy Week.
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